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lead free solder again
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I.F.
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 407

PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 10:13 pm    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

<mrdarrett@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152568963.513696.147460@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Quote:
I saw some pictures of those "tin whiskers", and I didn't know the
problem was so great.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_whiskers

So... is Airbus required to go for lead-free solder too, for RoHS and
all that...?

Hoo-boy... if so, wouldn't want to fly on any Airbus aircraft built
after 2006, then...

Michael


Military, medical & aerospace were the first exemptions granted - even the
brain-dead arseholes who passed this crap know how dangerous lead free
solder is!!!
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Joerg
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 05 May 2005
Posts: 3533

PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 10:19 pm    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

Hello Ian,

Quote:

I saw some pictures of those "tin whiskers", and I didn't know the
problem was so great.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_whiskers

So... is Airbus required to go for lead-free solder too, for RoHS and
all that...?

Hoo-boy... if so, wouldn't want to fly on any Airbus aircraft built
after 2006, then...

Military, medical & aerospace were the first exemptions granted - even the
brain-dead arseholes who passed this crap know how dangerous lead free
solder is!!!


Err, if the 2nd sentence under the last table in this link still holds
true Michael might have a point:
http://www.newark.com/services/rohs/exemptions.html

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com
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mrdarrett@gmail.com
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 23 Nov 2005
Posts: 305

PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 10:31 pm    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

Joerg wrote:
Quote:
Hello Ian,


I saw some pictures of those "tin whiskers", and I didn't know the
problem was so great.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_whiskers

So... is Airbus required to go for lead-free solder too, for RoHS and
all that...?

Hoo-boy... if so, wouldn't want to fly on any Airbus aircraft built
after 2006, then...

Military, medical & aerospace were the first exemptions granted - even the
brain-dead arseholes who passed this crap know how dangerous lead free
solder is!!!


Err, if the 2nd sentence under the last table in this link still holds
true Michael might have a point:
http://www.newark.com/services/rohs/exemptions.html

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com


Hmm... about that "some equipment used within an aircraft is within the
scope"... are they referring to the equipment used to play the
in-flight movies, or are they referring to the navigation equipment,
transponder, equipment to activate the flaps, rudder, etc.?

Michael
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I.F.
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 407

PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 10:32 pm    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

"Joerg" <notthisjoergsch@removethispacbell.net> wrote in message
news:eoAsg.44869$VE1.25918@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
Quote:
Hello Ian,


I saw some pictures of those "tin whiskers", and I didn't know the
problem was so great.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_whiskers

So... is Airbus required to go for lead-free solder too, for RoHS and
all that...?

Hoo-boy... if so, wouldn't want to fly on any Airbus aircraft built
after 2006, then...

Military, medical & aerospace were the first exemptions granted - even
the brain-dead arseholes who passed this crap know how dangerous lead
free solder is!!!

Err, if the 2nd sentence under the last table in this link still holds
true Michael might have a point:
http://www.newark.com/services/rohs/exemptions.html

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com

Europe has mad politician disease!!!!!
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I.F.
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 407

PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 10:47 pm    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

<mrdarrett@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152570713.493642.21590@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
Quote:

Joerg wrote:
Hello Ian,


I saw some pictures of those "tin whiskers", and I didn't know the
problem was so great.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_whiskers

So... is Airbus required to go for lead-free solder too, for RoHS and
all that...?

Hoo-boy... if so, wouldn't want to fly on any Airbus aircraft built
after 2006, then...

Military, medical & aerospace were the first exemptions granted - even
the
brain-dead arseholes who passed this crap know how dangerous lead free
solder is!!!


Err, if the 2nd sentence under the last table in this link still holds
true Michael might have a point:
http://www.newark.com/services/rohs/exemptions.html

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com


Hmm... about that "some equipment used within an aircraft is within the
scope"... are they referring to the equipment used to play the
in-flight movies, or are they referring to the navigation equipment,
transponder, equipment to activate the flaps, rudder, etc.?

Michael


That should be a clear cut case of in flight entertainment equipment isn't
aerospace equipment.
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Eeyore
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 22 Jun 2006
Posts: 642

PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 11:31 pm    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

mrdarrett@gmail.com wrote:

Quote:
I saw some pictures of those "tin whiskers", and I didn't know the
problem was so great.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_whiskers

So... is Airbus required to go for lead-free solder too, for RoHS and
all that...?

Hoo-boy... if so, wouldn't want to fly on any Airbus aircraft built
after 2006, then...

Several product sectors have been exempted. Tells it all really.
http://www.pb-free.info/rohsexemptions.htm

If avionics aren't in there ( possibly covered by other legislation ) it'll be a
worry given the high levels of vibration.

Some bright spark applied for an exemption for pro-audio ( no doubt on the basis
that ppl expect the stuff to last longer than 2-5 yrs ).

Shame that the video guys weren't so well on the ball !

Graham
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martin griffith
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 1098

PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 11:34 pm    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

On Mon, 10 Jul 2006 22:19:54 GMT, in sci.electronics.design Joerg
<notthisjoergsch@removethispacbell.net> wrote:

Quote:
Hello Ian,


I saw some pictures of those "tin whiskers", and I didn't know the
problem was so great.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_whiskers

So... is Airbus required to go for lead-free solder too, for RoHS and
all that...?

Hoo-boy... if so, wouldn't want to fly on any Airbus aircraft built
after 2006, then...

Military, medical & aerospace were the first exemptions granted - even the
brain-dead arseholes who passed this crap know how dangerous lead free
solder is!!!


Err, if the 2nd sentence under the last table in this link still holds
true Michael might have a point:
http://www.newark.com/services/rohs/exemptions.html


Hmm, had a few beers, but, maybe we should **Insist** that

"servers, storage and storage array systems, network infrastructure
equipment for switching, signalling, transmission as well as network
management for telecommunications" must be lead free.

Why should something that just contains data be exempt

There seems to be unstated assumptions about the quality of domestic
products over industrial products and life span.

Sorry, run out of neurons, OK the idea needs some work....Just
inverting the argument can cause some "fun"




martin
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martin griffith
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 1098

PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 11:40 pm    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

On Tue, 11 Jul 2006 00:31:13 +0100, in sci.electronics.design Eeyore
<rabbitsfriendsandrelations@REMOVETHIS.hotmail.com> wrote:


Quote:

Several product sectors have been exempted. Tells it all really.
http://www.pb-free.info/rohsexemptions.htm

If avionics aren't in there ( possibly covered by other legislation ) it'll be a
worry given the high levels of vibration.

Some bright spark applied for an exemption for pro-audio ( no doubt on the basis
that ppl expect the stuff to last longer than 2-5 yrs ).

Shame that the video guys weren't so well on the ball !

Graham

Video doesn't exist, these days, its just a DSP function, so its
covered by the server " Gottcha"


martin
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Eeyore
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 22 Jun 2006
Posts: 642

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 12:09 am    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

martin griffith wrote:

Quote:
On Tue, 11 Jul 2006 00:31:13 +0100, in sci.electronics.design Eeyore
rabbitsfriendsandrelations@REMOVETHIS.hotmail.com> wrote:


Several product sectors have been exempted. Tells it all really.
http://www.pb-free.info/rohsexemptions.htm

If avionics aren't in there ( possibly covered by other legislation ) it'll be a
worry given the high levels of vibration.

Some bright spark applied for an exemption for pro-audio ( no doubt on the basis
that ppl expect the stuff to last longer than 2-5 yrs ).

Shame that the video guys weren't so well on the ball !

Graham

Video doesn't exist, these days, its just a DSP function, so its
covered by the server " Gottcha"

Oh it does exist. It's just a bit different. Think eng for example. Then there's
broadcast video mixers and the like.

Graham
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Paul Hovnanian P.E.
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 583

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 12:14 am    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

mrdarrett@gmail.com wrote:
Quote:

I saw some pictures of those "tin whiskers", and I didn't know the
problem was so great.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_whiskers

So... is Airbus required to go for lead-free solder too, for RoHS and
all that...?

Hoo-boy... if so, wouldn't want to fly on any Airbus aircraft built
after 2006, then...

Michael

Boeing too. They contracted quite a few systems out to EU suppliers on
the 787.

--
Paul Hovnanian mailto:Paul@Hovnanian.com
------------------------------------------------------------------
All men are mortal. Socrates was mortal. Therefore, all men are
Socrates.
-- Woody Allen
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Roy L. Fuchs
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 25 Dec 2005
Posts: 1208

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 1:26 am    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

On 10 Jul 2006 15:02:43 -0700, mrdarrett@gmail.com Gave us:

Quote:
I saw some pictures of those "tin whiskers", and I didn't know the
problem was so great.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_whiskers

So... is Airbus required to go for lead-free solder too, for RoHS and
all that...?

Hoo-boy... if so, wouldn't want to fly on any Airbus aircraft built
after 2006, then...

Michael

I am almost absolutely certain that avionics is in the exempt list.
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Roy L. Fuchs
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 25 Dec 2005
Posts: 1208

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 1:31 am    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

On Mon, 10 Jul 2006 17:14:20 -0700, "Paul Hovnanian P.E."
<paul@hovnanian.com> Gave us:

Quote:
Boeing too. They contracted quite a few systems out to EU suppliers on
the 787.

Even the fucktard EU knows when not to use pure tin CRAP.
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Michael A. Terrell
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 24 Mar 2005
Posts: 2291

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 2:51 am    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

martin griffith wrote:
Quote:

Hmm, had a few beers, but, maybe we should **Insist** that

"servers, storage and storage array systems, network infrastructure
equipment for switching, signalling, transmission as well as network
management for telecommunications" must be lead free.

Why should something that just contains data be exempt

There seems to be unstated assumptions about the quality of domestic
products over industrial products and life span.

Sorry, run out of neurons, OK the idea needs some work....Just
inverting the argument can cause some "fun"

martin


Because the politicians want to make sure the computers can print
their paychecks on time.


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
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Jeff L
electronics forum beginner


Joined: 04 Sep 2005
Posts: 47

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 3:01 am    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

<mrdarrett@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152568963.513696.147460@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Quote:
I saw some pictures of those "tin whiskers", and I didn't know the
problem was so great.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_whiskers



I've actually saw some tin coated boards with whiskers almost as bad as
that. There are some pics on the net with whiskers over 1 cm in length.
Also note that tin dendrite growth and tin whiskers are NOT the same thing.
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Barry Lennox
electronics forum addict


Joined: 05 May 2005
Posts: 83

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 5:13 am    Post subject: Re: lead free solder again Reply with quote

On 10 Jul 2006 15:02:43 -0700, mrdarrett@gmail.com wrote:

Quote:
I saw some pictures of those "tin whiskers", and I didn't know the
problem was so great.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_whiskers

So... is Airbus required to go for lead-free solder too, for RoHS and
all that...?

Hoo-boy... if so, wouldn't want to fly on any Airbus aircraft built
after 2006, then...

Michael

The bigger problem, is that while industry sectors can get exemptions,
it's becoming very difficult to get leaded components any more. Many
vendors have simply dropped them. And we are now starting to see that
many vendors will never be making new parts in a leaded option. So
unless the aerospace manufacturers have hangers full of leaded parts,
the exemption is no use. And even if they do have good stocks, they
will be locked into 2005/06 technology.

Maybe the problem will be solved when the first Airbus full of
Euro-crats crashes as a result of tin whiskers or tin pest?

Barry Lennox
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