FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups 
 ProfileProfile   PreferencesPreferences   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
Forum index » Electronix » Basics
What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser?
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 3 of 4 [48 Posts] View previous topic :: View next topic
Goto page:  Previous  1, 2, 3, 4 Next
Author Message
Externet
electronics forum beginner


Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 12:39 am    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

Radium:
First, it would not be a laser, would be a cathode ray emitter.

It is not that much difficult if your pointer pen can be somewhat fat :

Disconnect the deflection yokes from a small as you want portable B&W
TV with CRT. What you will see at turn on, is your free electron
pointing the inside of the screen.

See? Easy !

Miguel
Back to top
Lord Garth
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 24 Mar 2005
Posts: 363

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 12:44 am    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

"Externet" <externet@inorbit.com> wrote in message
news:1153269548.870204.119690@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Quote:
Radium:
First, it would not be a laser, would be a cathode ray emitter.

It is not that much difficult if your pointer pen can be somewhat fat :

Disconnect the deflection yokes from a small as you want portable B&W
TV with CRT. What you will see at turn on, is your free electron
pointing the inside of the screen.

See? Easy !


When you shut it off, you will see a dark spot where good phosphor used to
exist.
Back to top
mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu
electronics forum beginner


Joined: 08 Dec 2005
Posts: 27

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 2:51 am    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

In article <1153234688.804235.132930@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>, "Radium" <glucegen1@excite.com> writes:
Quote:

mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:
In article <6h1uo3-2hp.ln1@mail.specsol.com>, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com writes:
In sci.physics Radium <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:
Hi:

All laser pointers in the market use diode-lasers. What makes it so
difficult to make a pointer-sized free-electron laser?


Thanks,

Radium

You mean other than the size of stuff like vacuum pumps, high voltage
power supplies, and shielding required to generate a relativistic
electron beam?

Well, to begin with, the size of the accelerator required.

Is it possible to make vacuum pumps, high-voltage power supplies,
shielding and accelerators that are small enough to fit in a pen-sized
object?

Sure. Just do the following:


step 1: behave nicely the whole year.
step 2: come December, ask Santa Klaus to deliver the items above.
step 3: go back to step 1.

Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
meron@cars.uchicago.edu | chances are he is doing just the same"
Back to top
mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu
electronics forum beginner


Joined: 08 Dec 2005
Posts: 27

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 3:29 am    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

In article <6cKdnY2jwaNA6iDZnZ2dnUVZ_tCdnZ2d@comcast.com>, "Tom M" <tmiller@umaryland.edu> writes:
Quote:

mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu> wrote in message
news:de8vg.14$25.430@news.uchicago.edu...
In article <e9ibdc$8ss_005@s1003.apx1.sbo.ma.dialup.rcn.com>,
jmfbahciv@aol.com writes:
In article <rH_ug.13$25.190@news.uchicago.edu>,
mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:
In article <kh5uo3-hg6.ln1@mail.specsol.com>, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com
writes:
In sci.physics mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:
In article <6h1uo3-2hp.ln1@mail.specsol.com>,
jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com
writes:
In sci.physics Radium <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:
Hi:

All laser pointers in the market use diode-lasers. What makes it so
difficult to make a pointer-sized free-electron laser?


Thanks,

Radium

You mean other than the size of stuff like vacuum pumps, high voltage
power supplies, and shielding required to generate a relativistic
electron beam?

Well, to begin with, the size of the accelerator required.

Not to pick nits, but doesn't that require vacuum pumps, high voltage
power supplies, and shielding?

Sure. As well as RF cavities, power supplies for those, Steering
magnets (again with power supplies), quadrupoles, sextapoles and all
sorts of poles (again...), and then we get to the undulators.

Well, yeah, there is that pesky enclosure containing the electrons.

Yes, that too:-) And the operators' room with the coffee machine.

How many babysitters are needed?

Not too many. One for routine stuff but you'll always keeps at least
two, in case things get "less routine".

Don't forget the Federal Office of Free Electron Laser regulation. That'll
take some space.

Oh, don't even get me started on this:-)


Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
meron@cars.uchicago.edu | chances are he is doing just the same"
Back to top
jmfbahciv@aol.com
electronics forum addict


Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 60

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 9:07 am    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

In article <a7hvg.20$25.582@news.uchicago.edu>,
mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:
Quote:
In article <1153234688.804235.132930@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>, "Radium"
glucegen1@excite.com> writes:

mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:
In article <6h1uo3-2hp.ln1@mail.specsol.com>, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com
writes:
In sci.physics Radium <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:
Hi:

All laser pointers in the market use diode-lasers. What makes it so
difficult to make a pointer-sized free-electron laser?


Thanks,

Radium

You mean other than the size of stuff like vacuum pumps, high voltage
power supplies, and shielding required to generate a relativistic
electron beam?

Well, to begin with, the size of the accelerator required.

Is it possible to make vacuum pumps, high-voltage power supplies,
shielding and accelerators that are small enough to fit in a pen-sized
object?

Sure. Just do the following:

step 1: behave nicely the whole year.
step 2: come December, ask Santa Klaus to deliver the items above.
step 3: go back to step 1.

Huh? I thought you physicists asked the purple unicorn for
gifts. I'll never keep this stuff straight.

/BAH
Back to top
pbdelete@spamnuke.ludd.lu
electronics forum Guru Wannabe


Joined: 15 Sep 2005
Posts: 273

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 11:57 am    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

In sci.electronics.basics Externet <externet@inorbit.com> wrote:
Quote:
Radium:
First, it would not be a laser, would be a cathode ray emitter.

It is not that much difficult if your pointer pen can be somewhat fat :

Disconnect the deflection yokes from a small as you want portable B&W
TV with CRT. What you will see at turn on, is your free electron
pointing the inside of the screen.

Maybe this could be a starting point for an electronmicroscope .. Wink
Provided that deflection area is smaller, and vacuum is maintained with a pump.

Only detection missing Wink
Back to top
C what I mean
electronics forum beginner


Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 1:00 pm    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

Quote:

the size of the pen.

Radium's "pointer" is probably not a pen. It might be a dog but more
likely it's a Volkswagen. The Volkswagen Pointer is fairly common
outside of the US. It would have pleny of room inside for a small
free-electron laser. The engine could even power the laser.

http://www.volkswagen.ru/showrooms/pointer

The main reason you don't see free-electron laser equipped Pointers is
the very limited market, not a technological limitation. I'd agree it
would be beyond the state of the art to fit one in a pen or a dog.

True, however I CAN fit a pen in a dog Smile

Woah.. now that is too much info from you Pat! You have to get another
hobby, there are only so many dogs.. LOL!
Back to top
Lostgallifreyan
electronics forum Guru Wannabe


Joined: 13 Apr 2006
Posts: 241

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 1:50 pm    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

"C what I mean" <no spam@frontiernet.net> wrote in
news:E1qvg.5864$Oh1.3776@news01.roc.ny:

Quote:

the size of the pen.

Radium's "pointer" is probably not a pen. It might be a dog but more
likely it's a Volkswagen. The Volkswagen Pointer is fairly common
outside of the US. It would have pleny of room inside for a small
free-electron laser. The engine could even power the laser.

http://www.volkswagen.ru/showrooms/pointer

The main reason you don't see free-electron laser equipped Pointers is
the very limited market, not a technological limitation. I'd agree it
would be beyond the state of the art to fit one in a pen or a dog.

True, however I CAN fit a pen in a dog :)

Woah.. now that is too much info from you Pat! You have to get another
hobby, there are only so many dogs.. LOL!




Yes, but they vary, do they not? What we need to establish is the ratio of
pen to dog, taking into account the internal anatomy of said dog (taken as
species entire), and then to calculate the minumum risk factor due to dog
reluctance and the maximum risk factor posed by the various laws dealing
with bestiality in the various nations in which dogs are found. No doubt
there might also be laws pertaining to the insertion of pens in an
inappropriate manner.
Back to top
Lostgallifreyan
electronics forum Guru Wannabe


Joined: 13 Apr 2006
Posts: 241

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 1:52 pm    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

Not to mention the various byelaws liniting the numbers of pens per dog.
Oh, did I mention them? I guess I did. >Smile
Back to top
mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu
electronics forum beginner


Joined: 08 Dec 2005
Posts: 27

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:30 pm    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

In article <e9kso7$8ss_001@s997.apx1.sbo.ma.dialup.rcn.com>, jmfbahciv@aol.com writes:
Quote:
In article <a7hvg.20$25.582@news.uchicago.edu>,
mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:
In article <1153234688.804235.132930@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>, "Radium"
glucegen1@excite.com> writes:

mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:
In article <6h1uo3-2hp.ln1@mail.specsol.com>, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com
writes:
In sci.physics Radium <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:
Hi:

All laser pointers in the market use diode-lasers. What makes it so
difficult to make a pointer-sized free-electron laser?


Thanks,

Radium

You mean other than the size of stuff like vacuum pumps, high voltage
power supplies, and shielding required to generate a relativistic
electron beam?

Well, to begin with, the size of the accelerator required.

Is it possible to make vacuum pumps, high-voltage power supplies,
shielding and accelerators that are small enough to fit in a pen-sized
object?

Sure. Just do the following:

step 1: behave nicely the whole year.
step 2: come December, ask Santa Klaus to deliver the items above.
step 3: go back to step 1.

Huh? I thought you physicists asked the purple unicorn for
gifts. I'll never keep this stuff straight.

Well, he's a kid, what does he know about purple unicorns.


Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
meron@cars.uchicago.edu | chances are he is doing just the same"
Back to top
osr@uakron.edu
electronics forum addict


Joined: 14 Sep 2005
Posts: 73

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:52 pm    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

My hunch is radixm, archimexes plutonium , News2x2x and a few others
are a ongoing research project by some psych professor and his grad
students to find out how much bullcrap usenet experts will take. Note
that I put in the x's to fool the search engines, cause gawd knows we
don't need a 2o2o around again, unless its a Spectra 2020 doing 3
tunable watts whitelight in FEL mode and its free. Problem is you
guys just told this nut about the sacred dogs!, whats next, are you
guys gonna tell him about Area 52?. Maybe if we're luckly the Air
Force would invite him out to Starfire and teach him a few things, does
the remaining grey matter adsorb at sodium guidestar wavelengths? Make
sure we tell him how tinfoil hats actually improve coupling at 2.5 Ghz!

lol,

Steve Roberts
Back to top
Phineas T Puddleduck
electronics forum beginner


Joined: 16 Jun 2006
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 10:58 pm    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

In article <1153234688.804235.132930@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>,
Radium <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:

Quote:
Well, to begin with, the size of the accelerator required.

Is it possible to make vacuum pumps, high-voltage power supplies,
shielding and accelerators that are small enough to fit in a pen-sized
object?

Are you seriously asking this question?

--
Relf's Law? -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
"Bullshit repeated to the limit of infinity asymptotically approaches
the odour of roses."
Corollary -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
³It approaches the asymptote faster, the more Œpseduos¹ you throw in
your formulas.²
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
³Gravity is one of the four fundamental interactions. The classical
theory of gravity - Einstein's general relativity - is the subject
of this book.² : Hartle/ Gravity pg 1
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
Jaffa cakes. Sweet delicious orange jaffa goodness, and an abject lesson
why parroting information from the web will not teach you cosmology.
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
Back to top
Radium
electronics forum addict


Joined: 11 May 2006
Posts: 95

PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 12:58 am    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

Phineas T Puddleduck wrote:
Quote:
In article <1153234688.804235.132930@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>,
Radium <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:

Well, to begin with, the size of the accelerator required.

Is it possible to make vacuum pumps, high-voltage power supplies,
shielding and accelerators that are small enough to fit in a pen-sized
object?


Are you seriously asking this question?

Yes.

Quote:

--
Relf's Law? -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
"Bullshit repeated to the limit of infinity asymptotically approaches
the odour of roses."
Corollary -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
³It approaches the asymptote faster, the more Œpseduos¹ you throw in
your formulas.²
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
³Gravity is one of the four fundamental interactions. The classical
theory of gravity - Einstein's general relativity - is the subject
of this book.² : Hartle/ Gravity pg 1
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
Jaffa cakes. Sweet delicious orange jaffa goodness, and an abject lesson
why parroting information from the web will not teach you cosmology.
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
Back to top
Eeyore
electronics forum Guru


Joined: 22 Jun 2006
Posts: 642

PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 1:23 am    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

Radium wrote:

Quote:
Phineas T Puddleduck wrote:
In article <1153234688.804235.132930@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>,
Radium <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:

Well, to begin with, the size of the accelerator required.

Is it possible to make vacuum pumps, high-voltage power supplies,
shielding and accelerators that are small enough to fit in a pen-sized
object?

Are you seriously asking this question?

Yes.

You're even madder than some ppl may have thought in that case.

Do you enjoy ridiculing yourself on Usenet ?

Graham
Back to top
C what I mean
electronics forum beginner


Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 1:32 am    Post subject: Re: What are the obstacles to building a pen-sized free-electron laser? Reply with quote

"Lostgallifreyan" <no-one@nowhere.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9805974D06F71zoodlewurdle@140.99.99.130...
Quote:
Not to mention the various byelaws liniting the numbers of pens per dog.
Oh, did I mention them? I guess I did. >Smile

LOL!! Couldn't have said it better myself!
Back to top
Google

Back to top
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 3 of 4 [48 Posts] Goto page:  Previous  1, 2, 3, 4 Next
View previous topic :: View next topic
The time now is Sun Oct 22, 2017 3:24 pm | All times are GMT
Forum index » Electronix » Basics
Jump to:  

Similar Topics
Topic Author Forum Replies Last Post
No new posts Free Porn New Resource MovieJerker Basics 0 Tue Apr 27, 2010 10:37 pm
No new posts laser pickup installation eledora Repair 0 Thu Jul 17, 2008 1:29 am
No new posts building a 220 voltage source itpurt@gmail.com Basics 6 Wed Jul 19, 2006 2:15 am
No new posts Any decent free electrical cad programs out there ??? cornytheclown@hotmail.com cad 26 Sun Jul 16, 2006 1:23 am
No new posts light sensitive cell as pixel free ccd and interferometry... mustafa umut sarac design 2 Fri Jul 14, 2006 5:21 pm

Copyright © 2004-2005 DeniX Solutions SRL
Other DeniX Solutions sites: Unix/Linux blog |  Unix/Linux documentation |  Unix/Linux forums |  Medicine forum |  Science forum  |  Send and track newsletters


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group